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lokomotive
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« Reply #350 on: November 02, 2009, 04:50:30 PM » |
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I just managed to download that calendar. The division 2 "strat" date looks like a bit of an after-thought and the league isn't referred to again throughout the calendar. I can't see how it can start on the 3rd because of the FA Cup.
Thanks to our beloved FAT, miracles are always possible  |
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druryfire
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« Reply #352 on: November 02, 2009, 05:18:30 PM » |
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I just managed to download that calendar. The division 2 "strat" date looks like a bit of an after-thought and the league isn't referred to again throughout the calendar. I can't see how it can start on the 3rd because of the FA Cup.
FA Cup starts on 6th March, by 3rd April most teams would have been knocked out, so at least some games will be played. |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #353 on: November 23, 2009, 05:14:14 PM » |
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Who does everyone want to see go up from the Regional League. I'd like to see Chaing Rai (surely no team deserves it more than them after the season they've had), Narathiwat (missed out after conceding a 92nd minute equaliser on the last day of the season last year) and Rajpracha for their history.
Well my wish list looks like it may come to pass. To be honest, I'm a bit p*ssed off at Loei's failure. Not because we'll have to face them again next season (we did the double over them last season) but because it feels like our last-day heartbreak was for nothing. Having sneaked past us on the final day of the season, they don't even go on to make the most of their good fortune! |
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the_englishman
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« Reply #354 on: November 23, 2009, 05:52:51 PM » |
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druryfire
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« Reply #355 on: November 26, 2009, 02:17:56 AM » |
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Can anyone confirm any new clubs or next year? The Mahasarakham City website is showing 16 teams in the North-East league next year, nearly all provinces are represented! http://www.mahasarakhamcity.com/home.php |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #356 on: November 26, 2009, 12:26:04 PM » |
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Just had a look at it. That is every province in Issan (obviously, minus Khon Kaen and Sisaket). It's not accurate because they've got Ubon United in there who no longer exist (although Ubon are entering two teams in 2010 but neither are called Ubon United). It's just a list of evry province which they'll presumably delete as appropriate. Isn't the cut-off date for teams that want to enter sometime around now?
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druryfire
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« Reply #357 on: November 26, 2009, 03:26:29 PM » |
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I think cut off date was 16th November.
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the_englishman
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« Reply #358 on: November 29, 2009, 06:21:04 PM » |
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Loei 3 Chiang Rai 3 SP 0 Narathaiwat 0 Great news for Raj fans, as they win the group with ease! Good to see Narataiwat promoted rather than SP. No disrespect to SP fans but this is poetic justice for the conduct of the players. Table from siamsport.co.th: Team. Played. Won. Draw. Lost. + / -. Score.
1 Raj 8. 4. 2 2. 3 14.
2.CRU 8. 3. 3. 2. 1. 12.
3 Narathiwat8. 2. 4. 2. 0 10.
4 Prakan. 8. 2. 3. 3. -1. 9.
5Loei 8. 2. 2. 4. -3. 8.
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« Last Edit: November 29, 2009, 06:29:58 PM by the_englishman »
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druryfire
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« Reply #359 on: November 30, 2009, 12:52:34 AM » |
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So, the season's finally at an end.
For me, it went on a bit to long. Personally i think Chiagrai lost interest in the last few weeks!
So, teams from the North, South and Bangkok promoted.
So, question time.
Which are the strongest leagues at this level?
An all conquering Chiangrai struggled in the last few weeks, was this because of a generally 'crap' Northern League?
Were the 5 teams in this championship pool worthy of being their? Would Satun of the Southern league (2nd on goal difference done any better than Narathiwat?)
Would Ayutthaya of achieved promotion?
How would Korat have faired?
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Nigb
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« Reply #360 on: November 30, 2009, 02:17:23 AM » |
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druryfire
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« Reply #361 on: November 30, 2009, 03:08:16 AM » |
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I think that's a competition too many. The competition just played might aswell have been this Regional Super Cup in the making. If FAT don't watch themselves, they will kill the game with in my opinion, needless tournements. And why FAT had to outdo themselves with inviting Chiang Mai and Phitsanulok is beyond me? |
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lokomotive
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« Reply #362 on: November 30, 2009, 04:35:47 AM » |
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One more nonsense gap filler created by the FAT. Go ahead, think about your calendar, and focus on the important things, FAT!!! |
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the_englishman
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« Reply #363 on: November 30, 2009, 04:52:08 AM » |
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Total waste of time. It seems the FAT have crossed one mental barrier after a few decades - that of understanding what makes fans want to follow a team - only to hit another barrier. It seems they now have to be educated about the purpose of pre-season tournaments and what will make fans lose interest.
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SriRachaShark
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« Reply #364 on: November 30, 2009, 09:06:36 AM » |
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The name alone is enough to send shivers down your spine.
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Nigb
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« Reply #365 on: November 30, 2009, 09:53:59 AM » |
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why didn't they make a competition like this for the play off, accept the winners and runner ups of each region, choose a host city and play the league over a couple of weeks.
I hope that the top 2 from each region get a shot at promotion next season, (not that Ayutthaya plan to be 2nd again.)
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SriRachaShark
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« Reply #366 on: November 30, 2009, 10:31:26 AM » |
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Or better still.....why not guarantee the regional champions automatic promotion? Or is that too easy? : Could it be that they're just making it up as they go along? |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #367 on: November 30, 2009, 11:33:22 AM » |
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To be fair, as the season is now starting on the 14th Feb, these matches will just serve as pre-season friendlies.
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Vinnie
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« Reply #368 on: December 01, 2009, 01:25:22 PM » |
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Or better still.....why not guarantee the regional champions automatic promotion? Or is that too easy? : The play-off system is going to look even more ridiculous next season. There are going to be in the region of 70 teams fighting over three promotion places. The RL is a true mire: easy - far too easy - to get into, but very difficult to get out of. 15 teams and counting in the northeast division next season and no automatic promotion. |
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the_englishman
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« Reply #369 on: December 01, 2009, 03:34:42 PM » |
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Or better still.....why not guarantee the regional champions automatic promotion? Or is that too easy? : The play-off system is going to look even more ridiculous next season. There are going to be in the region of 70 teams fighting over three promotion places. The RL is a true mire: easy - far too easy - to get into, but very difficult to get out of. 15 teams and counting in the northeast division next season and no automatic promotion. Surprise, surprise, the FAT are allowing the leagues to expand faster than they can work out what to do with them. Not hard to guess why, is it? What would you suggest, Vinnie? I'd go for a knock out phase. A set number of teams from each regional division goes into a play off system, each round over two legs and the final a one off match. It can be arranged so the play offs are split into three regions. |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #370 on: December 01, 2009, 04:23:36 PM » |
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Or better still.....why not guarantee the regional champions automatic promotion? Or is that too easy? : The play-off system is going to look even more ridiculous next season. There are going to be in the region of 70 teams fighting over three promotion places. The RL is a true mire: easy - far too easy - to get into, but very difficult to get out of. 15 teams and counting in the northeast division next season and no automatic promotion. Surprise, surprise, the FAT are allowing the leagues to expand faster than they can work out what to do with them. Not hard to guess why, is it? What would you suggest, Vinnie? I'd go for a knock out phase. A set number of teams from each regional division goes into a play off system, each round over two legs and the final a one off match. It can be arranged so the play offs are split into three regions. But you still only have three teams out of seventy going up. I think I've stated before on here what system I'd use. That is, have two divisions (A & B) at Div 1 level (as was the case in 2007), and four divisions at RL level. Failing that, they could just relegate five from Div 1 and have every champion automatically promoted. Relegating five from a sixteen team division seems harsh but the FAT had no qualms about relegating five from a twelve team division in 2007 (Korat finished ninth that season but found themselves relegated anyway. The plan to relegate five was announced two-thirds of the way through the season in order to create Division 2 A & B in 2008, a format which lasted all of one season. You can imagine I'm quite bitter that we're even playing at this level). |
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the_englishman
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« Reply #371 on: December 01, 2009, 04:28:37 PM » |
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Or better still.....why not guarantee the regional champions automatic promotion? Or is that too easy? : The play-off system is going to look even more ridiculous next season. There are going to be in the region of 70 teams fighting over three promotion places. The RL is a true mire: easy - far too easy - to get into, but very difficult to get out of. 15 teams and counting in the northeast division next season and no automatic promotion. Surprise, surprise, the FAT are allowing the leagues to expand faster than they can work out what to do with them. Not hard to guess why, is it? What would you suggest, Vinnie? I'd go for a knock out phase. A set number of teams from each regional division goes into a play off system, each round over two legs and the final a one off match. It can be arranged so the play offs are split into three regions. But you still only have three teams out of seventy going up. I think I've stated before on here what system I'd use. That is, have two divisions (A & B) at Div 1 level (as was the case in 2007), and four divisions at RL level. Failing that, they could just relegate five from Div 1 and have every champion automatically promoted. Relegating five from a sixteen team division seems harsh but the FAT had no qualms about relegating five from a twelve team division in 2007 (Korat finished ninth that season but found themselves relegated anyway. The plan to relegate five was announced two-thirds of the way through the season in order to create Division 2 A & B in 2008, a format which lasted all of one season. You can imagine I'm quite bitter that we're even playing at this level). Hmmm, it seems difficult to find a compromise here. If you have a net group of seventy clamoring for three promotions pots, the logical thing to do seems to be to create a new division, but of course that in turn opens up new questions. Relegating five teams is too much IMHO. I guess four would be just about acceptable. |
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druryfire
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« Reply #372 on: December 01, 2009, 05:39:00 PM » |
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It's all a bit of a miff really, we don't have 70 clubs clamouring for promotion, it's more like 8 in reality. The other clubs are just happy to be playign football.
The league structure is now taking place, but still nobody knows the difference in class between DIV 1 and RL, and we probably won’t know until a few more seasons down the line. At that point, FAT should look at it and possibly add another level or split DIV 1 as Vinnie has said into two divisions but this still leaves a big debate into the promotion race for TPL, and which league was stronger etc.
At the moment, the current structure is a kind of lie, as we have had weak teams in Division One, such as Nakhon Sawan and strong teams in the Regional League. Over the next few seasons, we will see the more ambitious teams go up (if your good enough you will go up from 3 out of 5) and the stagnated teams of Division One go down.
But the last thing FAT need to do is make a mockery of the league system altogether and promote / relegate more than is needed just for the sake of it. Some clubs like it as it is, others won’t until they get out of it. But more promotion spots makes it just as easier to fall back into it
Biggest task is for FAT to tell us what RL is all about. Is it about the winning or just taking part? Ask Tak, ask Roi Et, they will tell you it's about taking part. The day they are told it isn't is the day they start folding
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the_englishman
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« Reply #373 on: December 07, 2009, 09:13:14 AM » |
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Perhaps my initial idea of a new division isn't so bad after all. There are a whole slew of new clubs vying for a piece of the brand new football pie. The FAT could set a system over the next couple of years so that clubs achieving a certain number of points or final positions are moved to a new League 2, while the rest are moved into League 3 which could be regional. As you say, the weaker clubs from League 1 will drop down anyway and things will stabalise. This seems to be the only sensible way to accommodate the large number of new teams.
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Nigb
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« Reply #374 on: December 07, 2009, 12:44:24 PM » |
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here is the updated (but not complete) list of Div 2 teams from http://www.thaileaguefootball.com/index.php?lay=show&ac=article&Id=85422North Chiang Mai Prea Uttradit Tak Phichit Petchabun Phitsanoluk Sukhothai Khamphaeng Phet Chainat Nakhon Sawan(R) *Lamphang *Uthai Thani *Payaow North East Buriram Chaiyaphum Loei City Mahasakham Suvanakhet Nakhon Prathom Nakhon Ratchasima Roi Et Sakhon Nakhon Surin Udon Thani *Ubon Tiger *SK Ubon Rachathani *Nong Kai *Nong Bua Lampoo *Amnajerlern Samut Prakan Eastern Central Ayutthaya Saraburi Thai Summit Lopburi Singburi Chachoengsao Rayong United Ratchaburi Prachuapkirikhan Nakhon Nayok Prathum Thani *Ang Thong *Kanchanaburi *Lopburi *Trad *Sra Keow *Samut Sakhon *Nonthumburi South Yala Nakhon Sri Tammarat Patthaloung Krabi Satun Phuket Pattani *Chumphong *Phang Nga *Surat Thani *Trang *Ranong |
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« Last Edit: December 08, 2009, 08:58:30 PM by Nigb »
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Vinnie
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« Reply #375 on: December 07, 2009, 12:52:07 PM » |
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here is the updated (but not complete) list of Div 2 teams from www.thaileaguefootball.com North Chiang Mai Prea Uttradit Tak Phichit Petchabun Phitsanoluk Sukhothai Khamphaeng Phet Chainat Nakhon Sawan(R) *Lamphang *Uthai Thani *Payaow North East Buriram Chaiyaphum Loei City Mahasakham Suvanakhet Nakhon Prathom Nakhon Ratchasima Roi Et Sakhon Nakhon Surin Udon Thani *Ubon Tiger *SK Ubon Ratchasima *Nong Kai *Nong Bua Lampoo *Amnajerlern Samut Prakan Eastern Central Ayutthaya Saraburi Thai Summit Lopburi Singburi Chachoengsao Rayong United Ratchaburi Prachuapkirikhan Nakhon Nayok Prathum Thani *Ang Thong *Kanchanaburi *Lopburi *Trad *Sra Keow *Samut Sakhon *Nonthumburi South Yala Nakhon Sri Tammarat Patthaloung Krabi Satun Phuket Pattani *Chumphong *Phang Nga *Surat Thani *Trang *Ranong You have got to be kidding me! How many teams!! The FAT thought 18 teams was too many for the TPL but it's ok for the Regional League East division!?!? Divison 1: 16 teams, 3 automatic promotion places Northeast Division: 16 teams, 1 play-off place WORST LEAGUE EVER.    :  |
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SriRachaShark
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« Reply #376 on: December 07, 2009, 01:56:40 PM » |
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These teams clearly need to be regulated somehow. There should be minimum standards and requirements before any of them should even be considered suitable to join the league. It's just becoming messier as towns and cities across the country try and jump on board the gravy train.
I'm all for local clubs being represented but if this really is the current state of affairs, we are in danger of falling (further) into complete farce.
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Vinnie
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« Reply #377 on: December 07, 2009, 05:18:44 PM » |
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And that list doesn't even include the Bangkok division. We're gonna be looking at 80-odd teams by the time the dust has settled. I'm in agreement with 't-e', we now need a fourth tier. With only a solitary play-off place up for grabs in each division there shouldn't be more than 12 teams per div'.
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Vinnie
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« Reply #378 on: December 07, 2009, 05:22:52 PM » |
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EDIT: 19 teams in central-east division. Madness.
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the_englishman
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« Reply #379 on: December 08, 2009, 08:38:34 PM » |
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I've revised my suggestion: create a new, 'Blue Square' style division for the new teams. Many of the existing division two teams were around well before the current explosion. Reward them for their loyalty; keep division two as it is and create a lower league in regional style with the new teams. Three teams win promotion and they replace the teams that finished bottom of that regional group in division two.
This seems by far the best way to deal with the swell in numbers, to me.
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Nigb
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« Reply #380 on: December 08, 2009, 09:04:31 PM » |
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How about 20 teams in Division 1 next year (2011), award 7 or 8 promotion positions for Division 2 teams and create a Division 3 with the lower ranked teams.
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« Last Edit: December 09, 2009, 03:03:25 PM by Nigb »
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druryfire
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« Reply #381 on: December 09, 2009, 01:23:25 AM » |
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I've revised my suggestion: create a new, 'Blue Square' style division for the new teams. Many of the existing division two teams were around well before the current explosion. Reward them for their loyalty; keep division two as it is and create a lower league in regional style with the new teams. Three teams win promotion and they replace the teams that finished bottom of that regional group in division two.
This seems by far the best way to deal with the swell in numbers, to me.
Greg, you can't just reward teams for loyalty for being in a league a few yeras ago. Besides, some of these teams have been playing for a while aswell, just not in the old Division 2. |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #382 on: December 09, 2009, 10:08:02 AM » |
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The FAT are also being very naive if they think they can maintain the regional purity of the divisions. Some teams from the Central & East division clearly should be shifted into the Bangkok division. And Prachup Kiri Khan should blatantly be in the southern division.
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the_englishman
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« Reply #383 on: December 09, 2009, 03:39:46 PM » |
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Greg, you can't just reward teams for loyalty for being in a league a few yeras ago. Besides, some of these teams have been playing for a while aswell, just not in the old Division 2.
I don't understand your second point Drury but I disagree with your first point. If we have a whole group of brand new teams, why should they all walk in and compete with teams that have been around for a long time? |
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druryfire
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« Reply #384 on: December 09, 2009, 06:48:43 PM » |
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Greg, you can't just reward teams for loyalty for being in a league a few yeras ago. Besides, some of these teams have been playing for a while aswell, just not in the old Division 2.
I don't understand your second point Drury but I disagree with your first point. If we have a whole group of brand new teams, why should they all walk in and compete with teams that have been around for a long time? Firstly Greg, thats what happened last year, so why not again this year? Afterall, last year was a kind of trial, no one would no what would happen. If this happens again in 2011, then FAT are in a pickle But Ok, i understand what you mean, but FAT are kind of having a recruitment drive at the moment. And to get provinces interested in running a team is part of it. But they are selling them the goal of being in the TPL. They don't want to tell them they have to start really low down the pyramid at step 4 or 5 as this wouldn't get some teams off the ground What i think FAT needs to do is to create a new level, but not just yet, they need to find out who can mix it at RL level and then create another feeder league a bit lower. As for my previous point, the fact is some clubs have been playing for a long time but never been invited or promoted into the Thai football system. All before RL was ever thought of. At the moment it looks like having a 20 team league in some areas, but if we split them now then we will have leagues of 12 and 8 for example. But this year will tell us who can handle it. If Roi Et for example get stuffed week in week out again, they will probably drop out come end of 2010. So what we don't need for next years campaign is feeder league after feeder league that might need re-jigging again the year after. What FAT need is a 20 team division with bottom 10 forming a new league. All this is done on playing merit rather than how long you've been playing. What you must remember is , that this is all new to Thailand, it's not like England where you enter at step 7. All this is new to Thailand, new teams will enter, but other teams will also drop out. It's happened in the past, so could just as easily happen again. |
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druryfire
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« Reply #385 on: December 09, 2009, 08:21:25 PM » |
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Phrae have been renamed Phrae United with new club logo and all.
Phuket have unveiled a new logo.
Cha Choeng Sao have also unveiled another logo, their 4th since 1999!! They have a theme for every badge. This year the logo is entitled ''The Golden Dream''
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druryfire
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« Reply #386 on: December 09, 2009, 08:23:02 PM » |
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Last year Ubon United got banned for 2 years. So have they just folded altogether, or will they make a come back in 2 years time?
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the_englishman
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« Reply #387 on: December 10, 2009, 03:14:33 PM » |
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Drury, thanks for clarifying your second point. With regards to your first, I see your idea but I think it's better to organised sooner rather than later. I don't think it will off-put too many new clubs for having to enter the league just one step lower. With the new interest in Thai football, they will be happy just to have a team. I do agree that things will settle with teams dropping out and so on, but I still think a new division is the best way to handle this, or perhaps we could go with Nig's idea?
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the_englishman
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« Reply #388 on: December 10, 2009, 10:32:26 PM » |
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If I can understand Siam Sport correctly, a new 'western division' has been added to D2.
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druryfire
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« Reply #389 on: December 11, 2009, 01:03:08 AM » |
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I've revised my suggestion: create a new, 'Blue Square' style division for the new teams. Many of the existing division two teams were around well before the current explosion. Reward them for their loyalty; keep division two as it is and create a lower league in regional style with the new teams. Three teams win promotion and they replace the teams that finished bottom of that regional group in division two.
This seems by far the best way to deal with the swell in numbers, to me.
I think thats an idea FAT toyed with a couple of yers ago when we had two 2nd division leagues. Although i have argued my point across, i think FAT should have thought about this when RL was first mooted, surely they have a plan? I suppose in reality, it would be better to get the structure in place as soon as possible and if thats relegating 6,7 or 8 in one go then fair enough. Just aslong as FAT lay down the rules at the beginning of the season. |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #390 on: December 16, 2009, 01:46:44 PM » |
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Confirmed on www.thaileaguefootball.com 72 teams in RL next year. Bangkok 10 teams South 12 North 14 Northeast 17 Central & East 19 19 in one division, 10 in another. Some teams from C & E could easily be moved to BKK to even up the numbers a bit. Maybe there's a reason for it. I'll hold fire until I'm in possession of all the facts. |
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the_englishman
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« Reply #391 on: December 16, 2009, 03:34:47 PM » |
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Like I said, I thought there was a 'western' division being created even though Thailand doesn't really have a 'west' due to its strange shape.
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druryfire
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« Reply #392 on: December 16, 2009, 06:40:31 PM » |
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That webpage also states which provinces do not ahve any team, it includes Prachinburi, aren't they in Division 1? Or have they dropped out altogether.
The southern league also seems to have a few duplicates or the same team named twice with slight differences in spelling.
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Vinnie
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« Reply #393 on: December 16, 2009, 07:25:02 PM » |
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I assumed the Prachinburi reference to be a mistake. I hope they haven't had to pull out; they were worthy champons in 2008.
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Nigb
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« Reply #394 on: December 16, 2009, 10:47:47 PM » |
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Prachinburi are listed as not having a team, probably the source is incorrect. The clubs website is still up and running . As for the for the duplicates, yeah, thats a mistake.
Although this is a final list we should wait for the FAT announcement before it can be considered final. Even after that I wouldn't be surprised if there was some more shuffling around.
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lokomotive
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« Reply #395 on: December 17, 2009, 05:32:48 AM » |
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Prachinburi are listed as not having a team, probably the source is incorrect. The clubs website is still up and running . As for the for the duplicates, yeah, thats a mistake.
Although this is a final list we should wait for the FAT announcement before it can be considered final. Even after that I wouldn't be surprised if there was some more shuffling around.
as always, and thats why i dont blieve anything until the league has been kicked off. |
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Vinnie
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« Reply #396 on: December 17, 2009, 12:51:43 PM » |
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Prachinburi are listed as not having a team, probably the source is incorrect. The clubs website is still up and running . As for the for the duplicates, yeah, thats a mistake.
Although this is a final list we should wait for the FAT announcement before it can be considered final. Even after that I wouldn't be surprised if there was some more shuffling around.
A couple of other questions. 'Nonthumburi' in the C & E division. Is that Nonthaburi? And is Mukdahan only known as Suvannakhet now? |
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the_englishman
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« Reply #397 on: December 17, 2009, 04:05:31 PM » |
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Prachinburi are listed as not having a team, probably the source is incorrect. The clubs website is still up and running . As for the for the duplicates, yeah, thats a mistake.
Although this is a final list we should wait for the FAT announcement before it can be considered final. Even after that I wouldn't be surprised if there was some more shuffling around.
A couple of other questions. 'Nonthumburi' in the C & E division. Is that Nonthaburi? And is Mukdahan only known as Suvannakhet now? There was talk of forming another Nonthaburi team but with the decision of Raj to stay put, I don't think it happened. So, who are Nonthumburi? |
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druryfire
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« Reply #398 on: December 17, 2009, 04:42:57 PM » |
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Prachinburi are listed as not having a team, probably the source is incorrect. The clubs website is still up and running . As for the for the duplicates, yeah, thats a mistake.
Although this is a final list we should wait for the FAT announcement before it can be considered final. Even after that I wouldn't be surprised if there was some more shuffling around.
A couple of other questions. 'Nonthumburi' in the C & E division. Is that Nonthaburi? And is Mukdahan only known as Suvannakhet now? If i remember correctly Mukdahan-Suvannakhet renamed themselves to Mukdahan, so in theory they should be in (can't see them on the list). Nonthumburi surely must be Nonthaburi. |
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Nigb
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« Reply #399 on: December 17, 2009, 08:08:30 PM » |
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where would I be without my proof readers  There is no Suvanakhet and there is a Mukdahan. Nonthumburi is my creative spelling of Nonthaburi and also Mahasakham are now called Mahasakham City. I'm sure there are more corrections and updates. |
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